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interview by: Tom Orgad
The career of maestro guitarist Ulrich (or Uli Jon) Roth has surely shown an intriguing, binding sequence of ripening and evolvement. Starting as the axeman of psychedelic-era Scorpions, gradually growing towards a heavy metal orientation with the band, then forming primary neo-classical, spiritually fueled hard rock outfit Electric Sun, and proceeding into an increasingly classical direction – his magical, singular touch has always been present, consisting a unifying common denominator of his enchanting, unearthly artistic presence.
Now, prior to the release of his latest ambitious musical project, titled Requiem, and just before a US tour he is about to embark on together with fellow guitarist Michael Schenker, we were lucky enough to be granted with an hour of his time, to talk of hs view of art and philosophy, as well as his personal career – past, present and future.
Maelstrom: So, what have you been up to these days?
Uli Jon Roth: I have been working on my computer, preparing some music scores. We will have some orchestra recordings in the beginning of August, and I still have to write a lot of music, scores and parts for that, so I'm working very hard at the moment to do that. At the same time I'm also preparing myself for an American tour. We are producing videos for projection in the background. So I'm extremely busy at the moment.
Maelstrom: What are the recordings for? Requiem?
Uli Jon Roth: Yeah.
Maelstrom: Can you say some more regarding this piece? We have been hearing about it for years.
Uli Jon Roth: I don't want to talk about Requiem yet. I only want to talk about it when it is finished, you know. That's better. There were several times in the past when I thought I would finish it, and then I didn't, and [comments were] already out. So I don't really want to do it anymore. It is a very big piece of music. I wrote four hours altogether. But I'm not going to release four hours, because it is going to be too long, too massive. So, I have edited it to be shorter, and then, first of all, I will release the shorter version. Maybe one day I can do the "director's cut."
Maelstrom: It should be interesting. You mentioned preparing videos for the tour.
Uli Jon Roth: I'm going out with a big screen behind me. On screen we are projecting, first of all, images of the orchestra. We are also projecting moving images of nature, sky, space, to go with the music. On some of the pieces there is a little story going on on the screen, but mostly it is just to enhance the general atmosphere of the music. But all this needs to be produced. I'm doing that at the moment. A director friend of mine is doing part of the work. Some of that I'm giving to others, some of that I'm doing myself. It is an enjoyable work, I really like doing that. But it is time consuming. It is one of the things that I'm doing on the side at the moment.
Maelstrom: Is this a part of your "Lux Artis" concept? I think it is a fascinating matter. On your website and poetry, you talk of music as a sort of divine spark coming out of the stillness.
Uli Jon Roth: The "Lux Artis Ex Tenebre" is quite wide reaching for me. It is like a model which gives a certain umbrella to all creative thought processes. Basically I think that we live in a time and age in which the true spirit of art have really been weakened, neglected and almost forgotten by large sections, of artists even, given away to shallow commercialism and such like. I'm not saying this because "I'm Uli now and I''ve seen so many changes." I'm saying this because I'm really convinced that this is the case. There were certain centuries before us which were really very truthful in terms of creativity. The force of arts was much stronger, and had more meaning in general for our culture.
But these times are long gone. We live in an era in which art has lost a lot of its impact and value in society. This is quite a deplorable state of affairs, and also a dangerous and sad one, from whatever angle you look at it. Art, and I don't mean just visual art, but all artistic endeavours: poetry, artistic writing, painting, music and sculpture, is very important. It is almost like a mirror for society, and for the best, and the most positive that human kindness has brought forward.
Maelstrom: What do you think of the modern views of the avantgarde school of thought, that claims that art should be a part of life, take place in every aspect of the everyday life, exist outside the museum?
Uli Jon Roth: Really great artists can maybe do that, as they are in an artistic state of mind all day long. I like to keep important artistic statements separate from trivial everyday aspects of life. When I go to the bathroom in order to brush my teeth, I may have an artistic idea, but there is nothing artistic about brushing your teeth, because everybody can do it, and it actually not something that has a value besides keeping your body healthy. It doesn't have a spiritual value and such.
Art does not have to be in the museum. Absolutely not. Art can be everywhere, Art can be on your walkman when you listen to music, which you can do in any environment. But I think art is to have a special place in our lives, and museum is a special place. You go to a museum because it is a place where a lot of artistic energy is condensed.
Maelstrom: So, how do you define the artistic dimension? You just said that brushing your teeth is not artistic.
Uli Jon Roth: How do I define it? What is the difference between brushing your teeth or cleaning your shoes, and creating a masterpiece?
Maelstrom: That is what I'm asking. How do you define a masterpiece?
Uli Jon Roth: Well, how do I define a masterpiece. A good question. It is easy for me to define it. I know it when I see it, or I know it when I hear it. It is difficult to describe to others why something is a masterpiece, particularly when you are just talking about something, not a specific piece of art. I could tell you about a certain painting, why I think the painting is a masterpiece. But let me take you up on that challenge. Lets think about it. We should be able to define it.
First of all, I think there are many different levels of artistic expression. Like, a little child of five or six may be gifted. She may be able to draw a little picture of a rabbit and make it look nice. For this child, it is quite an achievement, and certainly an artistic expression, because she is not producing something utilitarian. A few years later that little girl becomes an apprentice in a well known painter's studio. She learns how to draw properly, perspectives, painting techniques, compositions and so forth. But it will not yet allow her to make masterpieces. Although she may have acquired certain abilities, she will still have to travel quite a long distance to be able to get to the next level – to find something of her own style, and then achieve mastery within this genre.
Usually, masterpieces are only produced by masters of the craft. A master is somebody who has deep knowledge of his craft, and can apply that knowledge, but in my book, who also has something extra. And that is the dimension I am talking about. This something extra, which was once very good craftsmanship, is where art really starts. And the more this artist possesses of that extra quality, this undefinable quality – you can call it "genius," on various levels – the greater, usually, his productions will be.
So, when I speak about art, I don't necessarily mean the production of a five year old child. I mean mature pieces of art by mature artists. Of course, there have always been, and will be, young artists who have created masterpieces, but that is usually the exception. I could talk about it for hours, it is such a wide field which was I trying to explain with a simple story, so you can see my train of thought.
Maelstrom: And the additional element, the thing beyond mastery – the spark of genius – do you consider it objective, or subjective?
Uli Jon Roth: Nothing is objective in our life. We cannot be objective. The way our mind works, we can at best be partially objective. It is relatively easy to explain why we cannot be objective. Art is very subjective, but there is such thing, I believe... a common denominator. You will, for instance, find that most people agree roughly about what is beautiful and what is ugly. It has to do with archetypes and symmetry. A little baby will already be more attracted to a face which have perfect symmetry then to one which is completely asymmetrical. Because we have an inborn sense of beauty.
A good artist will have a very strong affinity with this sense. This is the reason why certain pieces of art, like certain Michelangelo, Beethoven or Mozart masterpieces have such a universal appeal on people all over the world, all over the centuries. There is a lot of common ground in how we view these things. But, a person who is not artistic, and not really in tune with art, may not really have developed that sense to some degree, will not be able to tell the difference between a masterpiece and a non-masterpiece. But it is all very subjective.
Maelstrom: I see in your art two different aspects. This of, say, Vivaldi – the classical art, and this of Jimi Hendrix – the one I identify with Dionysos, the spontaneous outburst of energy, a creative impulse. I realize how you say Vivaldi may produce a masterpiece, which is to be almost universal, although subjective. But what about the other pole, Hendrix? Do you consider his works masterpieces as well?
Uli Jon Roth: Absolutely. For me, many of his songs are complete masterpieces. He produced them through having exactly that spark of genius to a very high degree. He did not have training or a lot of technical knowledge, but he was able to transcend all that, because he had so much of the other. And that is why the final result of what he did is so perfect within himself.
Maelstrom: In your creation, you have gradually moved form the "Hendrix Pole," that of Rock, to the one of classical music. Could you point the reason for this?
Uli Jon Roth: The classical has always been a part of my world, but the framework I was working in in the Scorpions and Electric Sun didn't really allow me to bring it so much into the foreground. Afterwards, once I distanced myself from that framework, I was totally freed to do what I wanted at the time, so the orchestral and classical structured elements became much stronger in my music. But the other element is still there. So, as you say, the spontaneous, that force of chaos, almost – I call it "controlled chaos."
Maelstrom: Actually, I was referring only to the Scorpions. I Believe Electric Sun also featured many classical elements.
Uli Jon Roth: Yes, especially in the third album.
Maelstrom: Not only in the third album. My personal favorite album by Electric Sun is actually Earthquake. There is something very primary about it, very primordial, I think. I'd like to know what you went through during the period of the 70's. You have been in the Scorpions, gradually getting detached from them. Then, you form Electric Sun, and suddenly comes this great outburst, stream of ideas, new influences. According to the lyrics, it seems that you where also influenced by Eastern philosophies. What happened back then?
Uli Jon Roth: I was waking up. I think at the time when I was at the Scorpions, I was still somewhat asleep, spiritually and mentally, and also artistically. Then, I met Monika Dannemann. Through this connection I began to realize a lot more things, and actually started to wake up. More and more my creativity started to flow, in a broader sense. All the stuff you see in Electric Sun is an outpouring of that, a result of that creativity. I was creative before then, but I think that with Electric Sun my creativity and artistry went into a higher octave. Quite a few of the songs of the Earthquake album I had already written way before Tokyo Tapes. The title track, originally called "Instead of a Symphony," was written back in 1977, a year before I left the band. So was "Sundown" and some others. It was impossible for me to utilize that music in the framework of Scorpions. It just wouldn't have worked, wouldn't have made sense.
Maelstrom: Did you enjoy your time with the Scorpions during those days? Could you still identify with the hard rock vibe, or feel frustrated and eager to depart?
Uli Jon Roth: I was with the Scorpions for five years, and have enjoyed the first four. The last year I didn't really enjoy so much anymore. In fact, I remember how much I wanted to leave. And that is eventually what I did.
Maelstrom: And it seems that when you left, they went very extremely for a different direction. The album Lovedrive is very different from the previous releases of the 70's. It is much more commercial, and seems to be more targeted to the US market.
Uli Jon Roth: Maybe, I can't really comment on that. I have only heard the album once, and that was at that time, so I don't really remember.
Maelstrom: During your period of "waking up," besides meeting Monika, what were your sources of inspiration? Other artists, lores, spiritual doctrines?
Uli Jon Roth: there were so many, I would have to go back in my mind to that time. Some inspirations were always there, they were just growing. From the beginning, I pretty much did find my own way. Although, I did read a lot of philosophy, and studied all of the major religions and such. But it didn't take me very long to do that, and from the beginning I had a pretty clear idea about my own perception of things. Although, every once in a while I was confronted with some teaching, and it changed. I thought the ancient Indian Yoga tradition had some amazing wisdoms, also the teaching of Buddha. I had no problem to combine these with the Christian tradition, where I was coming from.
Maelstrom: Did you ever become a devotee?
Uli Jon Roth: No. I am only a devotee of Jesus. But I did also have a very good look at the Kabbalah. That was at the time of the first Electric Sun album. In fact, the song "Burning Wheels Turning" had a lot of these symbols in it. I think there is a lot of truth in the Kabbalah, it goes back to ancient times. Just like with Greek Mythology, and others, you have to translate these things in a metaphysical sense. You can't take them too much at face value. Once you start seeing your way, they can be translated. Once you find the key, they can be very helpful. At the time, I was looking for understanding. I was searching both inside and outside of myself. Sometimes I was searching quite intensely, and sometimes more casually. I don't have a particular method with these things. I find that whenever there is a need for me to explore, I do that, as time allows.
Maelstrom: So, has the search has not ended yet?
Uli Jon Roth: It never ends. Absolutely not. That would be just so boring. I'm comfortably learning, and I'm changing. I'm proud to change. I don't want to stay the same. I want to progress and get better. For me, that is very important.
Maelstrom: So what have been your recent findings?
Uli Jon Roth: At this part in my life, I'm working on so many different things creatively. It is a period of my life when I'm actually producing. I don't have much time for reflection at the moment. When I do reflect, it just ends up in the music. I go through phases of my life, and this phase is of pure creativity, not so much of searching.
Maelstrom: Sounds exciting and satisfying.
Uli Jon Roth: I'm quite pleased. The only thing that I don't like is that time is limited and, unfortunately. Pretty much all the things that I start come as big projects, and they seem to take forever. That can lay down a bit, particularly when you want to achieve a certain level of perfection.
Maelstrom: Now, at the upcoming US tour, you are about to hook up with Michael Schenker. Have you kept in touch since the early 70's?
Uli Jon Roth: Not really. Sometimes we exchange some emails and are on good terms. We are friends. But usually, we are always at our own things.
Maelstrom: How does a classical musician (as you are) feel about performing in front of a heavy metal crowd?
Uli Jon Roth: I can perform in front of any crowd. I don't make these distinctions, because I always try to break through the preconceptions. And normally, that works. I can play in front of an audience of 80 year olds, and in front of an audience of 10 year olds. In front of a heavy metal audience, or a pop audience. Particularly in the last few years, I have found a way to communicate across these boundaries. It doesn't work with every concert, but it does with most of them.
The atmosphere is very different. Every concert is different. I cannot always choose where I'm going to play. I can choose to a certain degree, like refuse certain shows, but on the tour you just play the shows that are on the agenda, which means that some times you play at a concert hall, and some times you end up playing in some club. There, we have to play slightly differently. The environment is different, and the environment effects the music. Also, I wouldn't play the same repertoire in a club and at a seated concert hall. It is a completely different feeling. When the people are standing up and geared up for rock, you can't play too many ethereal slow movements. It just doesn't work.
Maelstrom: What are you intending to play on this tour?
Uli Jon Roth: It will be a very mixed bag. We will play Metamorphosis, some Electric Sun tracks, some Transcendental Sky Guitar, some Scorpions.
Maelstrom: I have also wanted to ask you about a matter that is not really related to what we have talked about so far, but fans all around the world have interest in: it has been said that, at the time, a demo has been recorded for your early band Dawn Road. Is it obtainable in any way?
Uli Jon Roth: No. not really. We don't want to release it. We don't think it is good enough.
Maelstrom: You don't think it is good enough?
Uli Jon Roth: No.
Maelstrom: Because you know, many fans around the world would greatly appreciate it.
Uli Jon Roth: I know, but you can't have it all. Maybe one day when we are dead.
Maelstrom: You should write it in your will.
Uli Jon Roth: I don't want to say "no" completely, because we have changed our minds before. But at the moment, I cannot see it happening.
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