interview by: Roberto
Martinelli
Few are the bands that have truly managed to
expand on the technical death metal genre popularized by Suffocation over
12 years ago, and Cryptopsy is one of them. Cryptopsy's second album,
None So Vile (1995) was a milestone in the genre. Since then, the
band has signed to juggernaut label Century Media, and released an even
more out of whack technical masterpiece in 2000 by the name of And
So You'll Beg (reviewed in issue 2), solidifying Cryptopsy as one
of the premier death metal acts in the world. Recently, the Cryptopsy
camp has experienced some upheaval as vocalist Mike DiSalvo, who has been
on the last two albums, announced his departure from the band. I spoke
to Flo Mounier (the drummer and last remaining original member) over the
phone from his home in Montreal about the impending change and all things
technically ridiculous.
Maelstrom: So, obviously the big story is Mike
DiSalvo is leaving.
Flo Mounier: Yea.
Maelstrom: So, what brought about this change?
Flo Mounier: He basically had some engagements
that came up after some tours had been booked, and he couldn't do some
dates on the tour and just basically felt it was more important to do
the family thing than some shows. It was kind of a mutual break up type
thing.
Maelstrom: Isn't that a little drastic? Just
for some shows? You couldn't just wait and keep going on recording?
Flo Mounier: Um, (pots band in the background.
I imagine Flo standing over the kitchen sink doing the dishes with the
phone between his shoulder and his ear) well, it's him. Like, we asked
him. To us, it wasn't very important. Like a family, uh, get-together,
if you wish. But he wouldn't budge. It was other things on top of that
that have made it difficult. We can't basically stop a machine that has
to promote its album. If you start putting stops in the machine, and having
one member saying: "Well, listen I have to do this, I can't come
to the show, I can't come to the practice, I can't do that, I can't do
this," then, you might as well stop altogether. I've been in the
band for 10 years, and we practice three to four times a week, you know.
All the time, no stop or anything like that. And that's the way the band
has accomplished its success. And it’s the way we've been working for
a long time.
Maelstrom: So he's gonna move back? He's from
New York, right?
Flo Mounier: No, he's from Boston. No, no.
He lives with his wife in Montreal. He had this event for his in-laws
and stuff like that, that they wanted him to go to, or he wanted to go
to, or whatever. But it goes a little beyond that, but I can't go too
too much into it.
Maelstrom: So, what everyone wants to know now
is what kind of vocalist are you going to be looking for? Because, obviously,
Mike was a big difference from Lord Worm (Cryptopsy's first vocalist).
So, do you have a person in mind, or a style that you want?
Flo Mounier: Uh, yeah, yeah. Somebody that
can do both pretty well. But I want to keep the clarity aspect that Mike
had, as far as articulation and timing, and stuff like that. And at the
same time, go for different ranges, and what have you. I mean, we're lookin'
for somebody to not only replace him, but to add something new as well.
That's pretty much the guideline, I guess.
Maelstrom: Did you say you have the guy in mind?
Flo Mounier: Yeah, we've been trying out different
people.
Maelstrom: Can you give us any names? People
you liked?
Flo Mounier: No, I can't give you any names
at all; it's not a 100% sure. And I'm not one to start rumors.
Maelstrom: When would you like to have this
decision made by?
Flo Mounier: Uh, probably in the next three
weeks.
Maelstrom: Oh, wow.
Flo Mounier: Yeah, quite soon. We have no choice:
we have to practice for Europe.
Maelstrom: Is your next show Wacken?
Flo Mounier: Yeah, the next show's Wacken.
Mike's doin' that. (metal continues to clang in the background) And after
that it's gonna be the tour in Europe. Somebody's gonna be ready. And
if somebody has a little less experience playing shows back to back, then
they're gonna have to get their voice in shape, to embark on a tou of
like 30 dates where they're gonna have to sing every night.
Maelstrom: Since we're on the subject of vocals:
Since the music you play is so technical, do you think technical death
metal could have melodic singing? Would that be possible?
Flo Mounier: I wouldn't want it. It depends
on how it was done or brought about. But, personally, I don't think it
would fit what we're doin', or what we'd like to do.
Maelstrom: Why wouldn't it fit?
Flo Mounier: Well, just because I really like
that aspect… I mean, music is one thing, vocals are another thing…I really
like that aspect of having technical music and then having the technicality
of some vocal patterns, but having that rough edge to always keep it in
a brutal context. And not really too much melodic context. A good example
of this is, actually, a band that has done that on their last album and
pulled it off quite well is Dimmu Borgir. The range of different, if you
wish, melodic singing in the song itself. But it's not really technical…
Maelstrom: Right, it's a different style from
what you guys play…
Flo Mounier: It’s a little bit different. But
maybe if you had a singer along the lines of what the Deftones have. Where
they would bring different kind of ranges. He (the Deftones singer) can
get really aggressive. And when he's not aggressive, his melodies are
very sad or doom type, you know? That might work, but it all depends on
the music as well. I think it works more on a slower type, more of a heavy
feel than it does in a ridiculously fast or in your face. I really don't
see it, but if a band can pull it off and do it well, then that's great.
I have yet to see that, though.
Maelstrom: In a technical death metal band,
isn't the least valuable member of the band the vocalist?
Flo Mounier: Well, no, not really, actually.
Maelstrom: I mean, people would have that perception.
You hear all these other guys - the drummer, the guitarist and the bass
player- have all these skills. So what is the skill that the vocalist
brings to the table?
Flo Mounier: If you listen to Mike's patterns,
and he used to do, you have to give the guy credit. People that try out
have a hard time doing what he does, or what he did. That's very, very,
very technical, the parts that he was doin'. He's basically creating off
time, on time, playing off our time, playing on our time vocal patterns.
And just embellishing, or adding, if you wish, another layer to the cake,
and making it that much more comprehensive or incomprehensive. But he's
contributing, and using his voice as an instrument. And his voice is more
so used as a tempo and as a beat, as a sort of guide that follows me or
goes against me to create interesting patterns around the riffing and
beats.
Maelstrom: It's quite a common thing for people
when they start listening to this kind of music, they go: "well,
anyone could do that."
Flo Mounier: Right, well, let them try for
an hour, and have them cough blood.
Maelstrom: So is it really a process of having
your vocal chords get really scarred?
Flo Mounier: It's not even that. It's singing,
whether it be in singing death metal, or singing country, or Celine Dion.
It has to do with the diaphragm. You're singing from within. You know
that breathing point, where if you get hit there, you could die? That's
where the power comes from. (at this point the tape on side 1 ran out,
so I couldn't record some of what Flo had to say. Basically, he compared
learning death metal vocals to learning vibrato, in that both are art
forms that must be studied and practiced.) Yeah, some people cup the mike
and do your typical (does growly, breathy, generic death vox), noises,
but that's not what someone like Mike does.
Maelstrom: Yeah, sometimes it's hard to tell
what's what. And you bring up a point about it being a different art form,
and so I guess it's hard for it to be credible when you have schools that
will teach you vibrato, but you don't have schools that teach you death
metal vocals.
Flo Mounier: Because you can't have a school
that doesn't have a financial security.
Maelstrom: You bring up an interesting point
about having people consider this an art form. So what motivates you to
keep going in this genre? I mean, you have such amazing skills that you
and everyone else in the band has; but, basically, if you talk about the
people outside of those who are fans, no one knows who you are, if you
play your music, people won’t be able to know how to deal with it…
Flo Mounier: Right…
Maelstrom: …so why do you keep persevering?
Flo Mounier: Well, to me personally, I guess
it's just a challenge. It's a challenge to make it as ridiculous as possible…not
as ridiculous, but I mean…
Maelstrom: No, I understand.
Flo Mounier: …you know, to push myself, and
actually listen to people, and watch people say: "Oh my God, that
IS completely ridiculous!" And making it easier all the time; making
it easier for myself to do all the time.
Maelstrom: I've heard you say that Blasphemy
Made Flesh (the band's first) is a throwaway album.
Flo Mounier: Um, no, it wouldn't be a throwaway
album, but I like everything that's new; I like doing new stuff. It's
not me, you know what I mean?
Maelstrom: What isn't you about it?
Flo Mounier: Well, it's not me. I mean, it
was me. I'm my biggest critic. And for me, it wasn't…I don't know. I mean,
there are some interesting parts, and I'm proud of that album. And out
of the three albums (Flo really did say three, and not four), I guess
I would listen to that one the least. But I think it's a great album.
There's some great hooks on it, and this and that. But me personally,
I would listen to it for the fun of it, for background music. I don't
know if I said that. I might have said that, but, no, it’s a progression.
All the albums are progression - you gotta start somewhere, right?
Maelstrom: Is it really difficult to deal with
all the member changes? Isn't that really rough on a band, especially
one as technical as yours, to have someone who can really handle the material?
How do you deal with that?
Flo Mounier: Yeah, um…you'd expect by now that
I'd be used to it. (laughs) How do I handle it? Well…how do I handle it?
Maelstrom: I mean, it's not new that people
in bands in metal change.
Flo Mounier: Yeah. I'll put it to you this
way: something that'll be very easy to understand. You're working, right?
Your boss decides to leave. You get a new boss. You're working next to
a guy that you like a lot, but he gets fired. What do you do? You keep
on working, right? That's the point of making your money, and you have
to stay there, and you're gonna work just by conditions. As far as that
aspect of the band goes, this is where I would say the reason we keep
on going and keep on doing it is to not stop something that's working.
You see what I mean?
Maelstrom: Ok.
Flo Mounier: If I were to see the band was
going nowhere, the band regressing instead of progressing, there's no
reason for me to continue doing it. I would jump on something else and
start something else. You know what I mean? You can’t draw water from
a stone. So, in that sense, I would change and try something else. But
in the sense where Cryptopsy is just progressing and getting a bigger
fan base, doing bigger tours; promoters booking extensive European tours
because we're on the package, and this and that. It means that there's
a fan base out there, and it's growing. I can't just say: "well,
listen, Mike's leaving, I'm fed up of these changes. Quit the band."
But why? It's stupid. If the guy wants to leave, he wants to leave. Everything
happens for a purpose. If so be it, so be it. I'm not gonna throw away
my career that I've been working 10 years to accomplish with the reputation
of the band just because another member has had enough. It's not to say
anything against Mike. I work with the guy, I see him every day, and I
love the guy. He's a great guy, you know what I mean? It's his choice,
and I'm not gonna make the same choice.
Maelstrom: Who's departure was harder to deal
with? Mike's or Lord Worm's?
Flo Mounier: I think Mike's. I think Mike has
a great vocal style; he's a great vocalist. I think definitely him. Because,
you see a lot of people try out…and not to shit on them or Lord Worm,
because I love his stuff too and I think he's a great guy as well, but
his vocal style was less complex than Mike's is. What he does is easier
to pull off.
Maelstrom: Talk about the progression of Cryptopsy's
sound. Mostly thinking about the technicality of the music, but also the
production. Because if you look at the first two albums, they're a lot
more raw and dirty sounding. The third album changed a lot, and the fourth
album - I don't want to call it clean, cause it's not - but it's a lot
more big.
Flo Mounier: Uh-huh.
Maelstrom: What do you think about the progression
your band is taking?
Flo Mounier: Actually, they go hand in hand.
That's funny that you mention that, because it makes me realize that.
They both go hand in hand. The progression is this: The progression of
the musical style is that, we'll get a little more technical, a little
bit more complex in song structure. Getting a little bit more musical
too. So adding a little bit more notes here, notes there, wanting it to
sound clear and not cluttered. As we get more technical, as things become
a little bit trickier, as I put like, let's say more fills in or more
details or more color with more toms or cymbals or what have you, that
old production wouldn't work anymore because you wouldn't hear anything.
Therefore, as the band progresses with its musicality, the production
has to progress in that you're making things clearer, not necessarily
not distorted or what have you, but clearer in the sense where you're
separating it, like when you separate stuff on a shelf? So that everything
has its place, and everything can be heard. And that's a very tough thing
to do, and I mean we didn't pull it off 100% at all on the last one (Whisper
Supremacy) but that's the goal: to try to make everything clear.
Maelstrom: Flo, you got ahead of me. I'm glad,
cause my next question is: what do you think about Whisper Supremacy's
production? I mean, I can tell you what I think, but I want to hear what
you think first.
Flo Mounier: I don't like Whisper Supremacy's
production. The drums are way too far back. Personally, I don't like that.
That was a mistake that we noticed right when we were mastering, but it
was a bit too late. The guitars, to me, are a little too up front, there
may be a little too much high end. It's hard to…the problem is in that
type of situation, when you've been writing and recording the album and
you're two months into it, you're so fed up that at the mixing it's very,
very hard to have an open mind.
Maelstrom: What I think, and some other people
think that I know is that it'd be a great production for a grindcore album,
but since it's so technical, you can't really hear what you're doing even
though you know it's there. And (the production) changed a lot for And
So You'll Beg. You got it right.
Flo Mounier: More so.
Maelstrom: You think there's a lot of room for
improvement?
Flo Mounier: I think so. I think there always
is. The unfortunate thing is it's usually money that'll decide.
Maelstrom: In terms of the budget?
Flo Mounier: In terms of the budget. The more
money you have, the more time you have, the more time you can take to
divide the sound and basically try to get the best thing. It's all related
like that. It's an unfortunate thing, yes, but we do with the means that
we have, and we'll try to pull it off even better the next time.
Maelstrom: Do you know how many tracks you recorded
your last album on? Is there an optimum amount of tracks to record on?
Flo Mounier: Oh, boy, that's a good question.
Maelstrom: Cause some people say: "oh,
the more tracks you use, the better."
Flo Mounier: Not necessarily. I think I lost
track, no pun intended, at like 37 or something like that. I mean, I know
it's a 24 board that we use, but you can expand that with the technology
that we have today. You know, 64, 72, whatever.
Maelstrom: What are you talking about? Like,
four different snares at the same time?
Flo Mounier: No, no, no. By tracks, I mean
like having kick drum triggers, and having the kick drums themselves,
and then having one top snare, bottom snare. As far as stuff we used,
we doubled up on the guitars. It really depends. There's a lot of details:
using two tracks for the bass sometimes for the more slappy parts, and
more of the picking parts. It goes on and on.
Maelstrom: Wow, that's something to pick someone's
brain about forever: where do you come up with these ideas? But it's probably
just trial and error, yeah?
Flo Mounier: Definitely. Definitely.
Maelstrom: What is your opinion of triggered
drums, and why do people use them?
Flo Mounier: There are different reasons why
people use them. My opinion on triggers varies. I find for the type of
music that I play, for the bass drums, it's nice to have so that your
musicians and yourself in a live situation can hear what you're playing.
If the sound guy isn't competent enough, which often time happens. The
sound guy wouldn't necessarily have the competence to give you a nice
bass drum sound, with an acoustic, dry sound. Or the monitor guy, or the
sound guy wouldn't put enough high end to be heard throughout the chaos
so that everybody knows what's going on. In that sense, it (triggers)
saves time, and it's easy. On a record, it saves time, and it's easy.
As far as feeling goes, it doesn't really matter, cause it's not like
your having ballad type parts or jazz swing type parts too much to worry
about in the type of music. There are jazz elements…you know, it would
be nice to have parts where you can have an acoustic sound and play with
the dynamics a lot, but anyways, the triggers nowadays can do the dynamics.
Maelstrom: Can triggers be a crutch to drummers?
Flo Mounier: They can and they often are. What
happens with a lot of drummers, and especially with the bass drums, well,
actually with the whole kit, is that they (the drummers) start hitting
less and less as far as strength. So it becomes like "you know, I
have triggers, I don't have to hit as hard." But when you play normally
without triggers…it becomes the lazy man syndrome, you know what I mean?
Triggers can become…It depends how you play 'em, like, I don't use 'em
to ptractice.
Maelstrom: You don't use 'em to practice.
Flo Mounier: No, I don't use them to practice,
I use 'em to play shows. And sometimes when I practice alone, which I
try to do everyday if I can, I won't use 'em. I'll never use 'em. I love
the natural sound of drums. For the snare and the toms, I'll never use
'em. Well, you can never say never, but as far as I'm concerned, I love
the dynamics of a snare because I do a lot of different - especially the
newer stuff - I do a lot of ghost notes, and doubles, and presses and
this and that, where I want that clarity, and not so clear things to be
heard and to be part of the background of the beats. For the toms it's
the same thing. I mean, you've heard 'em; Morbid Angel, Cradle (of Filth),
Dimmu Borgir, everything's triggered.
Maelstrom: Yeah, I mean, for example, Morbid
Angel's Covenant, where he (Pete Sandoval) does the double bass
stuff, you can't really hear it as well and then, on, I don't know if
it's Domination, but definitely on Formulas Fatal (to the Flesh)
you hear his kick drums, they're really powerful. It's like, "whoa,
that's a big difference."
Flo Mounier: Exactly. That's the thing. I like
Pete Sandoval and I think he's great, but when you hear him practice,
to warm up without the trigger sounds, and look at him, he doesn't hit
hard at all. Most drummers have to hit at a certain volume, you know what
I mean? Even jazz drummers have to hit at a certain volume to achieve
those dynamics. It depends on how you want to approach a drum too. If
you just want to do death metal and play just that, it might be your bag.
If you want to develop dynamics, it hinders that aspect of it, I find.
It really depends. It's not my bag, I don't really like triggers that
much, but…
Maelstrom: But you feel that you really need
to use them on your album.
Flo Mounier: Just on bass drums. Just because
it makes it easier. Also, if you take a really good trigger sound and
mix it to a nice natural sound it can be that much nicer.
Maelstrom: It was interesting to hear you say
that you use the acoustic sound and also the triggered sound together.
Speaking of jazz drumming, how would you compare the type of drumming
you do with Cryptopsy, with jazz drumming? Is technical death metal the
hardest overall?
Flo Mounier: No, they really don't have anything
to do with each other. There's aspects of jazz, as far as tempos, timing,
fills, but if you're taking death metal and taking jazz, there's one thing,
one big difference: it's feeling. Total feeling. There's a total different
swing to jazz than there is to death metal, which I try to incorporate
a little bit, try to feel it. It's (jazz drumming) a lot more on a touch
basis. Very loose. Very, very loose. So, when you’re playing at 80 mph,
to try to loosen up is very hard. That's something I've actually been
working on over the past years, like I said, to make everything easier.
And it's helping a lot and that part of my playing. Funk, jazz type playing
has helped loosen up my wrists and my ankles, and make things a lot more
fluid and a lot more easy.
Maelstrom: So how do you go about challenging
yourself? Cause, I don't think anyone teaches you at this point, so how
do you go about saying: "this is what I need to do, and this is how
I'm going to learn how to do it."
Flo Mounier: I watch videotapes, and I do take
some lessons occasionally from this guy in Montreal who's pretty diverse
in styles, like Latin, jazz, and all that stuff. I try to learn from that
and incorporate that into what I do. I also try to keep a routine of endurance
that makes it a lot easier for the feet and the hands.
Maelstrom: I'm a drummer also. I've only been
playing for about a year, but it's been my dream for quite a while to
start. I wanted to pick your brain as to what your practice routine is.
Flo Mounier: It depends. Ideally I want to
work on something that I don't know, ok? Which is the best way to learn
is to just do something you can't do. But usually, I'll warm up doing
10 minutes on the feet, 10 minutes on the hands, just doing singles. One
foot at a time, one hand at a time, on a metronome, and popping up the
speed every minute and a half just to keep that mechanism and routine
of movement working, so the brain doesn't forget and it becomes easier.
That helps a lot. I do a lot of improv jamming by my sel
Flo Mounier: sometimes I'll play along with
these synthesized riffs.
Maelstrom: You ever play electronic drums?
Flo Mounier: Yeah, I've played on them before.
Maelstrom: What do you think of those?
Flo Mounier: I like the Yamaha, the new one,
the DT Extreme. It's really cool. I have a lot of trouble playing metal
with those kits. I'm afraid to hit 'em too hard.
Maelstrom: They do seem fragile.
Flo Mounier: They're probably not, but they
do seem fragile, and I'm afraid to bash 'em.
Maelstrom: And they're very expensive.
Flo Mounier: Yeah, on top of it. But, yeah,
I like 'em. They're good for different stuff, you know what I mean? They
got great sounds, great diversity. But as far as practicing goes, it's
just something that you have to keep doing. I recommend an hour a day,
that's ideal.
Maelstrom: That's what I'm going for now. It's
a little tough for me. I just moved to Chicago a month and a half ago
to go to school. I brought my drums with me and I got these mesh heads,
cause I'm in an apartment.
Flo Mounier: Well, if you've got the money,
the electronic stuff's the best way to go.
Maelstrom: Yeah, well…(laugh)
Flo Mounier: C'mon, it's only 5000 bucks… That's
about it for practice.
Maelstrom: You know, people hear your drumming,
and people are so awestruck by you and I'm sure you've heard this I don't
know how many times (Flo laughs), and I can tell you're a humble guy about
it. But, how do you get like that? I read another interview with you from
another zine I write for, and it said you started playing when you were
13.
Flo Mounier: Yeah.
Maelstrom: How old are you now?
Flo Mounier: 27. I just turned 27.
Maelstrom: So, like, what…what…like, what, Flo?
How do you get like this?
Flo Mounier: Well, it's a good question. (pause)
Cause, I wasn't like this in the pre-Blasphemy days. So I think
what it was was a turnaround in attitude and a different outlook to what
I was doing as far as drumming goes. And I said: "well, listen, everybody's
playing this death metal stuff, and it seems to be 4, 5, 6, 7 basic beats,
and they're repeating them all the time, and I said "well, let's
try to break out of that and use 'em, but change 'em around, try new things…"
And it was such an underground genre that, you know, the sky's the limit.
So when I did it, it was accessible, changing stuff around, and this and
that, and then I just totally picked up on different vibes and different
genres of music, to try to fill my brain as much as I could.
Maelstrom: What inspired you to do that?
Flo Mounier: I thin a lot of it was listening
to other drummers, like the big boys: Dennis Chambers, Dave Weckl, Virgil
Donati. Watching them saying: "holy fuck, they just shred."
It's so smooth and easy looking. And that's what it should be. A lot of
it was Sean Reinert too, that Death Human album. Somebody's using
splashes in death metal. "Oh, boy!" you know? I mean back then,
it was like a sin, but now it's commonplace. And with Cynic (another band
featuring Reinert), it's weird: it wasn't my bag at first, and then I
got more and more into it, and that's what I think I like the most about
it: I didn't like it at first, and then it just grew on me and it became
so ridiculously awesome.
Maelstrom: Yeah, that Focus album is
really good.
Flo Mounier: Mmm. Yeah. It's different stuff
like that. Watching people that are better than me, I guess, is the best
way to learn.
Maelstrom: My last drum teacher didn’t know
anything about death metal. I said: "well, look, this is what I want
to sound like ultimately," and I brought him a tape - some of your
songs were on there. And he was really impressed. And he said to get like
that you basically have to make massive sacrifices and devote yourself.
So, what kind of sacrifices and devotion are necessary to play in a band
like Cryptopsy?
Flo Mounier: Well, you gotta smoke cigarettes,
you gotta drink beer, you gotta be a couch potato and watch a lot of movies,
eat some burgers. Uh, my discipline? I'll tell you. I guess the discipline
that we have, it's like I told you before, is that we practice on a regular
basis. I think the most important discipline would be to listen to all
different kinds of music. That's it. Honestly, that's it. Of course you
gotta be in somewhat healthy physical shape, but not even that. I mean,
you look at, I don't know if you know Dennis Chambers?
Maelstrom: Yeah, the funk drummer. Yeah, that
guy's bad!
Flo Mounier: He's a big guy.
Maelstrom: I've only seen him sitting down,
so…
Flo Mounier: I've never heard anybody or seen
anybody with faster wrists than he has, it's just completely ridiculous. So even when you're sitting down playing drums, it's a lot
of endurance I guess as far as beats go, but that's workable within months.
I think if you want to establish the technicality that I might have or
that Cryptopsy has, it becomes a thing where not only would you have to
have the endurance, but have the quick thinking and the timing to be able
to switch. Because it's one thing to be technical and it's one thing to
be fast, but it's one thing to be both.
Maelstrom: How is that different?
Flo Mounier: The speed and the technicality?
Maelstrom: Yeah.
Flo Mounier: I can't really tell you because
it's second nature. It's just throwing in quick things. It's like a long
route of quick thinking. That's what I see more and more in this type
of music. I see a lot of bands that are really fast or really technical.
And that's what I love about what we do, we can actually do both. And
we can go overboard. We've had some ideas before and we were like: "No
we can't do this. This is ridiculous." We actually watch ourselves.
The last album we did we watched ourselves, like: "no, we can't do
this."
Maelstrom: So, what would be overboard? Every
time a new album comes out, whether it be your band or the last band,
it's like: "it’s even more technical than the last one!" It's
like, where is the limit?
Flo Mounier: There is no limit, that's the
thing. You can be as fucking stupid as you wanna be. But the thing is:
are people gonna understand it. I mean, people have a hard time understanding
it as it is. And it's either alienate everybody and play music for yourself,
or play music that you like palying for yourself and try to get some fans
out of it. It’s weird, you can't really draw the line. It's not pop. Nobody's
telling you to cut the snares there and do less fills and make it more
poppy. So there is no real limit. It's great. But, there's music and then
there's showing off. We love to create a song that's gonna stand. It's
gonna be a song that's gonna be different from the next song, but it's
gonna have a kind of structure, a song structure that's gonna flow in
to each other. The riffs are gonna flow into each other. And that's why
sometimes we're not gonna go overboard and that's why we're not gonna
do a grind from beginning to end because it's, for us, a little bit boring.
So we don't want to get over crazy with the technicality, but we don't
want it to go stupid simple either.
Maelstrom: That brings up something else I've
been dying to know about technical death metal. How do you guys write
a technical death metal song? I've heard, for example, that band Meshuggah's
members don't even live in the same part of the world. And they'll write
these parts, and then stick these random parts, six or seven of them together,
and that's a song. Is that how it works with you? How do you know when a
song is finished?
Flo Mounier: Good question.
Maelstrom: Cause it's not like pop, like you
said. You don't have the verse-chorus-verse-chorus, and you do that a
few times and you're done.
Flo Mounier: Right.
Maelstrom: So how does it work?
Flo Mounier: The hardest part about writing
a song is beginning the song. Once you got the beginning of the song,
it starts to flow. It depends, we write together, but it used to be usually
Jon (Levasseur, guitar) and I who wrote the songs. He would come up with
the riffs and I would do the structure with him. Sometimes I would hum
riffs (huh? Hum Cryptopsy riffs? - Roberto) or whatever. Now there's a
lot more involvement with Eric (Langlois, bass) who's writing a lot of
songs too. That threesome seems to be connecting as far as songwriting.
It's weird, sometimes we'll have an idea for a whole song, and it'll just
mean restructuring, and embellishing, and embellishing, and embellishing
over months. And sometimes we'll just have one riff and play off of that,
and build it from there. And sometimes it'll take one whole month to write,
and sometimes it'll take a week. But usually it changes before recording,
as far as adding a little thing here, taking away a little thing. Tweaking
it, basically.
Maelstrom: Do you just know in your gut: "Ok,
that's enough for this song."
Flo Mounier: Yeah. Basically. "For We
Bleed," the second song on And Then You'll Beg, Jon had a
whole other part at the end of it. And at one point I said: "Man,
that's it. You don't need any more. It's already fucking six minutes,
and it sounds great like this." If you add that, it would be overkill.
Sometimes they're short, sometimes they're long. There's, like I said,
no real guideline. So, to us, as long as it sounds good and makes sense,
we're pretty sure it's gonna sound good and make sense to somebody else.
Maelstrom: That's really the thing, Flo. I've
seen you guys play twice live. And I've seen other bands who are technical
also. What's really fascinated me that when you play live, it's exactly
the same as on CD. So, there are two parts to this question. One: How
do you keep all this shit straight in your head?
Flo Mounier: (laugh) ok.
Maelstrom: I mean, it's kind of a stupid question.
Obviously, you keep it straight because you practice it, but at the same
time, how do you keep it straight in your head to do every single little
hit? Are you counting the whole time?
Flo Mounier: But it's not. It's not every single
little hit. There's some improv that I do on fills. You're right, though,
it's very close to the album. All the punches, all the catches, most of
cymbal work. Some of the fills I'll embellish. I like to add stuff, especially
on the old stuff. I get bored of playing it one way.
Maelstrom: Man, you seem faster live than on
record. I don't know how that works.
Flo Mounier: Definitely.
Maelstrom: Seriously. When I hear you play live,
I'm like: "That sounds a lot faster." How do you do that? Isn't
it the opposite that's supposed to be true.
Flo Mounier: No. No ,no. No. It’s usually the
adrenaline. We're a live band, you know what I mean? I think we give a
lot better show live than we do on CD. You hear it on CD, and it's like,
"wow, great." You see it live, and it's like, "WOW!"
You actually see the visual, and you see what's going on. It's not just
a sound or a sample or this and that, it’s actually what they're doing.
Um, remembering the parts, it’s just practice. If I don't play a song
for two months, I'll have to pick at it a little bit to get back into
it.
Maelstrom: 'Cause these things aren’t melodic;
they're not catchy by nature.
Flo Mounier: No. Some of it's counting. I'll
tell you the truth: some of it I count. A lot of it is just routine. If
I want to add one more cymbal, I know where to add it; a little splash
here, a little tweak there, it's routine. It's hard to explain because
that type of thing comes second nature. Sometimes I'll have a memory blank.
Maelstrom: I just imagine you going: "onetwothreefourfivesixseven
onetwothreefourfivesixseven onetwothreefourfivesixseven, onetwothreefourfive
onetwothreefourfive…" And just like counting these ridicuolous odd
times, and thinking, "how can he do that" and play?
Flo Mounier: Just on some parts.
Maelstrom: Ok. (laugh)
Flo Mounier: Like: "Onetwothreefourfiveonetwothreefourfivesix,
onetwothreefourfiveonetwothreefourfivesixseveneightnine, onetwothree,
onetwothreefour, onetwothreefourfive, tadadadadada…" You know, a
song part like that, because they necessitate that kinda stuff. Other
parts it's much easier. After a while, you get used to it, and you can
go by the groove too. For the new stuff, for the most part, we're counting
a lot more and that's helping us too, because we can put everything on
anything and have it match. On the last song, "Screams Go Unheard,"
in that middle part which is like (does his rhythmic impression of the
part). The middle part with Mike whispering? That's basically, let's see,
one-two-three, one-two-three, one-two-three, one-two-three, and that's
the whole riff, and that's what the guitars are doing all the time: one-two-three,
one-two-three. But I decided to do some math and try to fuck it up. So,
the first measure, I'm doing one-two-three, one-two-three, one-two-three,
one-two-three, then I'm doing one-two-three-four, one-two-three-four,
one-two-three-four, one-two-three-four, 'til five. And then I go back
to the one-two-three one-two-three, and it just becomes total chaos. At
one point, the math adds up and we meet.
Maelstrom: Ah-hah!
Flo Mounier: And that's when we go into the
other riff.
Maelstrom: Wow.
Flo Mounier: And after, we were like: "whoa,
this is cool. People are gonna get fucked over by this," (Flo starts
to get excited) and then we're listening to it, and we're like: "Fuck,
it sounds like it's gonna fit anyway," you know what I mean? It's
weird, if you really listen to it, everything's off. I mean, the guitars
aren't coming in down with the beat at all, until that fatal moment where
(does some beats) everything's together. Stuff like that is just fun:
you're playing with math, you're playing with numbers; it's funner to
write that way. You get a sense of the music, a wider picture of the music.
Maelstrom: Talking about playing with math,
some people who I can imagine who don't go for your style as much would
say: "Man, it's just too technical, it's not enough about the feeling.
It's too cerebral." What do you think about that?
Flo Mounier: To each their own. That's what
I think. I basically think that too. I can't listen to death metal all
the time, and I rarely do, actually. I need that break. I can understand
people who say: "That's too hard to digest." I like stuff that's
hard to digest because it's challenging. It challenges my ear and it makes
it more interesting because every time I listen to it, I can catch something
else. It has something different. But I totally understand where people
would say, "wow, this is too much." But they could listen to
it, and there's some simplicity to it. We don't want to go too far away
from that, either. It's very important to have something technical, but
I think it's equally as important, or even more important, to have something
simplistic and catchy.
Maelstrom: So, Flo, what's up with the latest
trend of having digeridus in extreme music?
Flo Mounier: I don't know, man…
Maelstrom: It's poppin' up everywhere! You're
like the fifth band that I've heard with a digeridu in it!
Flo Mounier: Yeah, right? I don't know. We
had heard it a couple times, and I knew what the instrument was like,
and this and that, and I said…
Maelstrom: It’s not a very technical instrument.
Flo Mounier: It's a very cool instrument.
Maelstrom: No, I mean it's not very technical.
(I mean, how many how much variation can you get out of a digeridu? It's
an ambient instrument rather than a melodic or rhythmic one.)
Flo Mounier: It can be, that's the thing.
Maelstrom: Really?
Flo Mounier: Oh yeah. The guy we hired for
the album, he's a genius. He had like tons of different digeridus that
had different tones and pitches and this and that, and he would use 'em
so well, it's unbelievable. Anyway, it's pretty crazy. I don't know, all
I had heard of digeridu was Sepultura, and I was like, "that'd be
a great idea for a song intro," and all of a sudden bands are popping
up with digeridu (laugh. Flo has a very subdued, exhaling laugh)…whatever.
It's a cool instrument, it's a cool sound. It's a drone sound. It's a
dark sound.
Maelstrom: It definitely is.
Flo Mounier: I guess that's why people are
using them.
Maelstrom: Ok, last major question.
Flo Mounier: Ok.
Maelstrom: There's a fairly prevalent opinion
about Century Media (the label on which Cryptopsy is) that they ruin extreme
bands once they sign them to their label. And, you know, I could name
off some bands, but I'm sure you're heard this before.
Flo Mounier: Ok.
Maelstrom: What is your opinion on that? Also
considering that your band hasn't gotten less extreme, but, and we talked
a little about this before, the production is a lot less raw since you
went over to Century Media.
Flo Mounier: Well, it wouldn't be them (Century
Media) directly telling us anything. We have complete artistic freedom.
So, if bands go on Century Media…
Maelstrom: It can't be a coincidence.
Flo Mounier: Well, maybe it's just the bands.
Maybe it's the bands themselves. We never had any problems with…well,
we've had problems with Century Media and some disagreements, but if they
don't like the music, they don't like the music. What can I tell you?
I'm not gonna write another album for you, you know what I mean? But they're
not gonna do that. They're gonna say it's good, unless it was total shit,
then I want them to tell me it sucks. But other than that, they don't
have…It's not that they don't have, they like what we do. They signed
us for a reason. As far as cover, it's different in Germany. They don't
like a lot of the art stuff we do in North America, but that's just their
concept of it. But they're kinda tough over there, too. Anyway, it's a
different subject altogether. No, I would disagree with that (the original
question) because I have no problems with them as far as judging our music
or telling us what to do. With the production, it was totally us who wanted
to do it that way. It has nothing to do with them.
Maelstrom: Century Media never puts out any
bands that have this necro or really dirty production. You just don't
hear it.
Flo Mounier: Right. I understand what you mean.
But, most bands that do come out now don't really have that sound anyway.
The only bands that I hear that have garage type sound would be demos.
Maelstrom: What do you think about black metal?
Flo Mounier: Depends on the black metal.
Maelstrom: Not Dimmu Borgir.
Flo Mounier: Some's good, some sucks. It's
just like death metal: some's good, some sucks.
Maelstrom: What do you think about power metal?
Flo Mounier: Uh, power metal…I like power metal,
but it's to an extent.
Maelstrom: Ok, who do you like?
Flo Mounier: Do you consider Deftones power
metal?
Maelstrom: No. Hahaha!
Flo Mounier: Ok, so, uh…Pantera would be power
metal, then?
Maelstrom: No. Power metal would be like Helloween,
or like…
Flo Mounier: Oh, you mean 80s metal! (laugh)
Maelstrom: Yeah! Like 80s metal! Like all the
bands that want to be Helloween! Like Primal Fear…all those German bands.
Flo Mounier: Like Nevermore, maybe?
Maelstrom: Nevermore used to be. Their first
album was power metal, but now they sound like Pantera.
It's funny, a lot of people think Pantera's power metal,
but no, it's the stuff that has the high vocals…
Flo Mounier: But at the time when it came out,
that's what it was called. It was power metal.
Maelstrom: Well, Pantera's first album, when
Anselmo actually sang…
Flo Mounier: True enough.
M:…was more power metal, definitely.
Flo Mounier: True enough. Well, I really don’t
listen to it. You know what I listen to? I like King Diamond. That's the
extent of my power metal. Hahaha.
Maelstrom: Thanks for that.
Flo Mounier: Huhuhu. No problem.
Maelstrom: Is Cryptopsy your full-time job?
Flo Mounier: No, no.
Maelstrom: What do you do?
Flo Mounier: I actually work at an internet
company.
Maelstrom: What do you do for them?
Flo Mounier: I collect.
Maelstrom: You collect money?
Flo Mounier: Yeah.
Maelstrom: So you're like a bruiser.
Flo Mounier: No, but I collect over the phone.
I've done everything for that company. It's a great job to have, actually,
because they let me go on tour whenever I want, and it's pretty good salary.
I could live off Cryptopsy, but I wouldn't be living as comfortable as
I'd like to be. And I wouldn't have the money to buy all the equipment
and pay my rent at the same time.
Maelstrom: Thank you very much for your time.
Flo Mounier: Hey, I appreciate the support.
Maelstrom: Hey, good luck in Wacken.
Flo Mounier: Thanks a lot. You take care of
yourself, now.
Check out Cryptopsy's superb web site at www.cryptopsy.net.
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