interview by: Roberto Martinelli

With the recent break up of Centurian, God Dethroned has become the clear cream of the crop in Dutch death metal. The band’s last album, Ravenous, showed a group that was just getting better and better with each release. This despite having to find a different drummer for each recording.

Strangely, though, God Dethroned ditched a lot of what was making it so successful on the new record, Into the Lungs of Hell. I spoke to Jens, God Dethroned’s lead guitarist, to pick his brain about the stylistic change and find out if he’d ever tried freedom fries.

Maelstrom: It seems that you change drummers quite often. You’ve had three different drummers on the last three records. How about the guy now? Is he going to stick around?

Jens: I’m pretty sure. Roel (the drummer that left after the Bloody Blasphemy album) was an integral part of the band. He held everything together, rhythm-wise. We would have worked with him for the rest of our careers if it hadn’t of been that he couldn’t tour with us as much as we wanted. It was at the end of the Bloody Blasphemy touring period that it was becoming too much for him, and us as well. We had a tough time then: tour after tour, and a very short time to acclimatize to the rhythm. So we were faced to find a replacement or work with session drummers for the rest of our careers. Tony (Laureano, of Angel Corpse and Nile) was the obvious solution.

Maelstrom: Yeah, that guy’s amazing.

Jens: Yeah, he is. He’s fantastic. We got to know him quite well when we were on tour with Angel Corpse, and as a drum tech for Cannibal Corpse and Morbid Angel. He was available since Angel Corpse had just split up and he had not joined Nile. We figured if anyone could do the trick of coming to the studio, recording the songs, and going home, it would be him. The songs turned out a little faster than previous material, which was perfect as Tony’s lightning fast. We pretty much were certain that we couldn’t find anyone who could do those paces. We toured with drummers we knew, like Janne (Saarenpäa from the Crown).

Maelstrom: So you’re saying that Janne isn’t as fast as Tony?

Jens: He is.

Maelstrom: Yeah, that guy’s amazing, too.

Jens: Absolutely. We were quite content with working with session drummers, ‘cause we knew we wouldn’t find someone on the open market, so to speak, who was not yet taken by at least a dozen bands. But there were four guys who wanted to audition. Three of them could match Tony’s pace. We were really surprised. Ariën was by far the most hard-hitting and tight one of all. We decided to go with him, and he’s really been the main axel.

Maelstrom: On the last three records, at least, you’re blessed to have been able to find all these drummers that can play. Obviously, Tony isn’t Dutch, but do they grow on trees in Holland?

Jens: There’s a lot of good drummers and musicians here. But we were not in any way expecting to find someone who could even match Roel’s pace. We wanted to make this new record to show that we were alive and kicking. Ariën is, in my opinion, even tighter than Tony, but just a fraction slower. He’s like a human metronome. Only one or two times in all the shows we’ve played so far have I actually heard him play something wrong. He hits his grind and blast parts just as hard as his other parts.

Maelstrom: I wanted to share this story with you, because it’s too funny. It’s about how stupid my government is. They have cafeterias in the White House. The US is a little unhappy with France because France won’t help out in the war against Iraq, right?

Jens: Yes.

Maelstrom: Since they’re irritated with France, they’ve changed the name of french fries and french toast in the cafeterias to freedom fries and freedom toast.

Jens: ...I’m sorry, but can you get any more lame than that?

Maelstrom: Isn’t that amazing? (Laugh)

Jens: I’m really sorry, but your country’s political agenda is not mine.

Maelstrom: It’s funny. No one that I know thinks that any of this (war) is a good idea, but there must be someone who thinks it’s a good idea.

Jens: I’m sure that the weapons industry thinks it’s a good idea. But to change french to freedom...I suppose they’ll have freedom kissing, too. I mean, I’m not really fond of France’s politics. They have this specific position that’s more or less opposite to the Dutch view in drug policy and some other policies as well. They’re our sort of nemesis, so to speak, in a political sense. For once, I’d agree with Germany and France. The United Nations, in my opinion, is the most important body and it should not be ignored. If you go around it, you might as well disarm the whole organization.

Maelstrom: I don’t see there should be any obligation for France to help out by sending troops. But it’s a very, very frightening time.

Jens: I can imagine. I just hope that everyone has the sense to back down if they have to back down and not live up to their word or reputation. Iraq and Saddam Hussein has to be dealt with, but in what way is open to discussion. Of course, there are many sides to this political story, and I’m not one to comment on that. But I will comment on the fact that french fries is no longer french fries. That must be one of the most ridiculous things I’ve ever heard.

Maelstrom: I think they actually voted on it. There’s a bit in the article that the French embassy pointed out that fries actually come from Belgium. It gets funnier and funnier.

Jens: This has got to be THE news of the day for tomorrow when I see the band. We can laugh at it around the coffee table. My god. Thank you for sharing this. You’ve made my day, actually.

Maelstrom: You mentioned a little bit about the differences in politic between France and Holland. I read this interview with that band Severe Torture, from your country. The guy being interviewed was asked if he would like to go live in the US. He said no, that the United States was nice to go tour through for two months, but he wouldn’t want to live there, because “Holland has so much more freedom.” What did he mean?

Jens: I do agree with him totally. I don’t know if I’d refer to it as “freedom” exactly, but it’s an atmosphere. Going to the States and comparing that to Holland, Holland is much more mellow. The freedom that he means is the freedom of speech. The influence you have as a civilian here on the system is more than there. In the States, the word “freedom” is used very often, but I think in the actual sense, I’m not sure if it’s actual freedom. I think that the stories that reach us are colored, but the way that the police handles in the States compared to how the Dutch police handles it is the difference between night and day. There’s a different approach to social and political issues. If you step out of the plane like I did here (after we came back from the New Jersey Metalfest), the atmosphere between the airport in Holland and Newark Airport is so immense. It’s a totally different mentality. It’s difficult to put a finger on it.

Maelstrom: I understand. I’m half European and have been to Europe many times. I think a big difference between the two places is that in Europe, there’s a lot more of a cultural awareness and knowing about the world.

Jens: That is true, especially in the sense that Europe has more of a culture anyway, as in an ancient culture. The US, Western lifestyle hasn’t been around for that long and in general lacks that backbone, that structure of culture. I think it may be lacking in the education of the people. Also, looking at the media in the States, they play a big, big role. At least the images we’ve been sent in Europe is that TVs in the States are on day and night. You get fed information day and night. This is information that is colored. It’s always a biased opinion. I think when a TV is on day and night, you see truths instead of opinions. That is also maybe what limits the sense of freedom. Europeans are maybe better at relating. In the US, it’s difficult, as all you really see is that TV screen. You get the same messages repeated over and over again. I think that may inhibit the sense of development and freedom.

Maelstrom: Isn’t it funny that, despite your comments, that this Western lifestyle that you’re describing seems to be taking over world culture more and more. Ironic, isn’t it?

Jens: It is ironic. Looking at Holland right now, media is beginning to play more and more of a role. That’s why our lyrics are more socially critical this time. In the media in Europe, these 24-hour news stations, as well as the half hour infomertials, they go on forever. That’s one of the many examples of American culture taking over the rest of the world. In part, that’s a good thing, ‘cause it enriches an already existing culture here. But it also means that the society becomes homogenized.

Maelstrom: You brought up the topic of having the lyrics in the booklet. I think it’s unusual and pretty remarkable, in a good way, that you have little explanations for each song. The ideas for the songs are pretty cool. I never listen to death metal for lyrics, but if I ever do look at them, I don’t know what the heck they’re all about. They don’t make any sense to me. You know? I wonder if there are any sense to them. But here, you’ve got songs about animal rights, and quite a few media-related songs. You’ve always had wacky lyrics: stuff about poison apples, 1562... but now there’s a focus on writing lyrics that are more socially relevant this time?

Jens: I think the reason for that and why our lyrics sometimes turn out a bit wacky is that we only take, like, 5-6 weeks to write our music. Usually, the lyrics are also born in this period, or right after we enter the studio. They come out in a really spontaneous way. Anything that we see that interests us at the time might show up in the lyrics. We have a lot of time during touring (touring is 90 percent waiting, 10 percent hurrying to get the hell on stage and off again). In that period you have a lot of time to discuss your views on the world; your fears and your concerns; as well as your disgusts for religion as well as other political issues. When we were in the studio, we had no government. It had fallen. There was the bombing in Bali, the hostage situation in Russia, the pressure with Iraq. That gets reflected. With the animal rights topic, we were talking about this with our Swedish producer, who said that the bio industry in Sweden was just about the worst one in Europe. We started talking about that and realized that it’s basically like a concentration camp, the way these animals get treated. It seemed like a logical topic to discuss, as it disgusts us. We’re all conscious meat eaters. It’s way too fine to leave it aside, but if we can get organically raised meat, we’ll definitely take that. When Henri wrote the lyrics and we read them, we thought, “if we print this, people are going to think we’re anti-Semitic.”

Maelstrom: Really?

Jens: It handles about gassing the masses.

Maelstrom: Yeah, but that’s a stretch. I think there are so many more things you can pick on other bands about that.

Jens: Yeah, true, but we don’t want to be associated with that, ‘cause we’re not like that. We’re strongly against racism in any form. This way we can consciously make liner notes saying what we’re doing to animals is exactly what Germans did to the Jews in World War II. It’s just other living beings with less of a soul or a mind, or whatever. It’s the same kind of careless behavior.

Maelstrom: How can you be anti-war but death metal?

Jens: hehehehe... Music is a form of expression. That really is the focus for us. The lyrics are something that get added in the end. The music is like a ball of frustration and anger. The lyrics have to reflect on that. You’re not going to sing about flowers, for example, in a brutal death metal song. So it’s sort of a tradition to use lyrics that are aggressive. It fits the picture. I see it as a reflection of a moment when you write this music. It takes away negative energy and creates positive energy. With the speed and intensity of that in itself is a good motivation to make this music, not necessarily the aggressive facet of it. It just turns out aggressive. If there’s any scene in the world that’s free of war and aggression, it’s this scene.

Maelstrom: What do you mean, “free of war”?

Jens: Free of conflict.

Maelstrom: I’ve found that metal people give the best interviews and are the nicest people and they have the most brutal music. It’s an interesting contrast.

Jens: Talk about a weird contrast, but it’s true. This sounds really cheesy and cliché, but you get rid of all this negative energy. It might make a more mellow person out of you. I’m not sure. It probably takes a certain personality, maybe a split personality, to be a nice guy and to make this sort of shit. Still, I think it makes you a healthier person. That is, talking in general: there are very unhealthy people in death metal. The prejudice against metal, as being destructive for our youth, that sort of stuff is not true.

Maelstrom: I know when I go to shows and see five totally brutal metal bands, at the end of the night I’m thinking, “wow, I’m so brutal-ed out.” This energy is fine for one night, but I can imagine if I had to be on this tour for 2+ months, and being every night in this total aggro atmosphere... doesn’t that wear you down?

Jens: It does, in a way, but it gives a lot of energy back as well, being on stage and expressing yourself and focusing on a product that comes from you as a band. Feeling the power when you get it right gives so much more energy than what you lose from the level of sound or the beats per minute. It is a fact that when you are touring for that long, you don’t watch the support acts that many times. You watch a couple of shows completely, and for the rest of the tour you see five or 10 minutes, and that’s all. You need to get away. For myself, when I’m in a night liner or a van, I’d rather hear very mellow music than death metal all the time. I remember when we were touring with Cannibal Corpse, for example, some of those guys would listen to Krisiun afterwards, and others would listen to very, very mellow music. When I’m on tour, I rarely listen to metal. What you said earlier gets to be too much, but playing every night is no problem. It wears you down in the sense that we play in a very physical way. It is heavy doing that every night. I have to stretch good my legs and my arms and my neck to make it through a tour like that. Mentally, it’s not demanding.

Maelstrom: It’s funny how you start the new record off with the slowest and most relaxed song of the album.

Jens: hehehe... Yeah, I don’t know. We had the lyrics written for that song first. We thought it might be a good title for the album. When we got into the studio, we thought it might be risky to make it the title track. Because it’s a very strong song, the melody sticks very well and it’s easy to sing along, we took the risk and put the slowest song on first.

Maelstrom: I have to say that I’m personally a much bigger fan of Ravenous and even Bloody Blasphemy. The reason is that I see you’ve gone away from the contrasts you had on those records with solos or piano pieces that would come in that were prettier in comparison to the riffs. You’ve gone away from that. Was that a conscious decision to make something more brutal or less soft in some parts?

Jens: Not really. It’s good that you said that. Most people think [Into the Lungs of Hell] is a more melodic album than the previous ones, which I disagree with. We worked for two weeks in a row for this recording, instead of working for a couple of days at a time. We had a lot less time to arrange the songs. What’s on here is a very spontaneous way of writing, one that wasn’t thought about that much.

Maelstrom: Yeah, it seems that way.

Jens: Aha... You’re the first one to remark this.

Maelstrom: It feels more rushed than the other records. I mean, I don’t mean to come into the interview and tell you I don’t like your record...

Jens: No, no! It’s fine that you say this. It’s true, in a way. Well, in a way, it’s not, ‘cause we weren’t rushed, but we didn’t have as much time for the arrangements of the songs. The melodies are strong in our opinion. It seems so as a lot of people think it’s more melodic. But there are less melodies and double melodies.

Maelstrom: You still have the cool harmonies that you have always been doing. There’s less stirring melody. It’s much more chuggy and pulsating.

Jens: Exactly. The brutal atmosphere isn’t in the speed anymore. In general it’s a slower album, and more heavy. Ravenous was definitely the most contrasting album, having completely over the top speed and very melodic parts. My best work is on that album. A lot of people seem to think otherwise. My recognition for my leads comes more now for Into the Lungs of Hell.

Maelstrom: No way, man. The leads on Ravenous are the best ones you’ve done.

Jens: Thanks. I agree with you on that one. It’s fun to hear different opinions.

Maelstrom: It’s a nice, tasty tidbit of contrast. You have these melodic parts that aren’t necessarily totally in character. You had mentioned once in an interview about injuring your arm.

Jens: Uh-huh. That’s still a factor, actually.

Maelstrom: So, what happened?

Jens: I just played too much. Right after the Bloody Blasphemy sessions, I had three days of intense drumming. I had already strained my arm during the recording of Bloody Blasphemy. Right after I started to pace my drumming with metronome, and I just went too fast. Within two hours, I wrecked my arm for three years. Mostly I play at half speed now because I can’t play at full speed anymore. Well, I can, but for short periods of time. For the <Ravenous>, I didn’t do any rhythm work at all. Now I have found my rhythm and know my boundaries. I did three and a half songs on the new record. That was quite an accomplishment because I never thought I could do that again. I recently recorded an album with another band of mine, which is much more thrash oriented. I’m doing quite well with that. I’ll never get rid of [my injury].

Maelstrom: You can’t get medical treatment for it?

Jens: I’ve tried physical therapy and all sorts of medicine, but it’s not working. It’s strained. It’s a chronic thing. But I can tour ok. The Metalfest in New Jersey went quite well.

Maelstrom: Did you have much hand in the production of the new record, Jens?

Jens: Least of all this time. Ravenous was produced by Henri and me.

Maelstrom: I have to say again, that the production on the Ravenous is the best one you’ve done. I don’t think it could get much better than that.

Jens: ...well, thank you again! I’m glad to hear it.

Maelstrom: What do you think about the production on the new one?

Jens: I’m part happy with it, though I haven’t really heard it that well yet. We laid down four open tracks on the guitar this time, which was good. It’s more heavy than ever. I think we will return to this studio for next time, but with a bit more influence on the production from ourselves.

Maelstrom: I think the production has lost a bit of its power. The drums on the Ravenous are a lot more full and kick more ass.

Jens: That’s probably because the last one is triggered and the new one is not.

Maelstrom: The last one isn’t triggered?

Jens: Nope. That’s just how he played.

Maelstrom: I’m really surprised. I was sure that the new one is triggered.

Jens: There are triggers on the kick drums that give that extra click, but they’re underneath. You hear the original signal with a little bit of the click.

Maelstrom: Wow. You learn something new every day.

Jens: This is the amazing thing about this drummer. He did this thing in six hours. It was perfect. The guys in the studio worked with guys like The Haunted, and they said, “whoa, we’ve never seen a drummer as amazing as this one.” Six hours is usually quick in itself, but usually you have to shift the signals with the computer a bit to make them in sync when you trigger them. But this is exactly what he played. When you put triggers on them, usually that makes the signals stick out so that you hear every beat that’s not tight. With Ariën, you could throw away the acoustic signal and it would still be dead tight. He’s the best drummer I’ve ever worked with.

Maelstrom: What’s the highlight of being in God Dethroned?

Jens: These last bunch of songs and the last shows we’ve played with Ariën on drums have created so much energy on stage, that it’s been the most fun to play in a band, ever. The new tours coming up will be the high point of our career.

Maelstrom: Thank you so much for your time.

Jens: Thank you, man, for the very interesting interview.

from left to right: Jens (guitar), Beef (bass), Henri (guitar and vocals), Ariën (drums).

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